Dr. Kam Ghaffarian
Founder and Executive Chairman of X-energy, Intuitive Machines, Axiom Space and Quantum Space
I believe that the ultimate destiny for humanity is to become interstellar, so that's really my ultimate vision – to be able to travel to other stars outside our solar system. But, in order to make any of that happen, you need to take steps toward that.
Summary
In this episode of Leadership Matters, Alan Fleischmann sits down with Dr. Kam Ghaffarian, founder of IBX and co-founder of pioneering companies like Axiom Space, X-energy, Intuitive Machines, and Quantum Space.
Kam shares his remarkable journey—from immigrating alone to the U.S. at 17 with borrowed money, to building billion-dollar companies shaping the future of space exploration, clean energy, and human health. He opens up about his early fascination with the stars, the cultural challenges of adapting to a new country, and how a deep sense of purpose has guided every venture he's launched.
Kam’s reflects on his time building great cultures, fostering innovation, and creating companies that are not just profitable, but profoundly impactful. He also discusses the mission behind his nonprofits—the Emerging Light Foundation and the Limitless Space Institute—and the belief that business and philanthropy must work hand-in-hand to advance humanity.
Mentions & Resources
Guest Bio
Kam Ghaffarian is the visionary space and energy entrepreneur behind several companies dedicated to furthering human civilization, including Axiom Space. After co-founding Axiom Space in 2016 to unlock space’s potential for innovation through commercialization, he serves as Executive Chairman of the Board and a key strategic advisor on the development of the space economy.
Kam started his entrepreneurial career in 1994 by founding Stinger Ghaffarian Technologies, Inc. (SGT), a government services company focusing on IT, engineering, science applications, and mission operations. SGT became NASA’s second-largest engineering services contractor, providing ISS operations and astronaut training support and generating annual revenues of over half a billion dollars, and was eventually acquired by KBR. He previously held numerous technical and management positions at Lockheed Martin, Ford Aerospace, and Loral, among others.
Driven by his mission to advance the state of humanity and human knowledge, Kam has created organizations transforming the space and energy sectors. In addition to co-founding Axiom Space, his other companies include, Intuitive Machines, a leader in deliver science technology NASA’s Commercial Lunar Payload Services program, X-energy, which is developing nuclear power solutions for both terrestrial energy and space propulsion use, and IBX, an innovation and investment firm. Kam is also an active philanthropist and founder of a non-profit focused on scientific research and enabling interstellar travel. Kam holds several degrees including undergraduate degrees in computer science and electronics engineering, and an M.Sc. in information management.
Transcript
Alan Fleischmann
Welcome to Leadership Matters on SiriusXM and at leadershipmattersshow.com. I’m your host, Alan Fleischmann.
I’m joined today by a guest who’s an expert in the space industry and someone who’s created numerous companies over his career: Dr. Kam Ghaffarian. Born and raised in Iran, Kam emigrated to the United States at a young age and has truly lived out the American dream. He has used his education to build a career and companies across industries including aerospace, nuclear energy, and healthcare, as well as nonprofit education organizations to teach the next generation.
Among the many companies Kam has created are Stinger Ghaffarian Technologies, Intuitive Machines, X-energy, Axiom Space, IBX, and Quantum Space — all of which are pushing the boundaries of what’s possible in space technology and exploration, energy creation, and more.
I’m excited to have Kam on the show today to discuss his early life and influences, his entrepreneurial journey, his philanthropic work, and the many lessons in leadership he has learned along the way. I’m also looking forward to sharing his personality with our listenership, because he is quite an extraordinary individual who combines enormous vision and confidence with gratitude and humility.
Kam, welcome to Leadership Matters. It’s a pleasure having you on the show today.
Kam Ghaffarian
It’s such a pleasure to be with you, Alan, today, and I very much look forward to this. Thank you.
Alan Fleischmann
Let’s talk a little bit about your early life in Iran. What was life like around the house? What did your parents do? I know you have an older brother, but any other brothers and sisters? Anything else that was special and different about where you grew up and at home?
Kam Ghaffarian
Yeah. So I was born in 1958 in Isfahan, Iran, which is, I believe, one of the most beautiful cities in the world, with beautiful mosques and minarets. It was also a haven for Armenian and Jewish populations in Iran. I grew up with amazing parents that really motivated me with education and making a better life for yourself. And I was there till the end of 1976, and I arrived in the United States at almost 18 years old in January 1977.
Alan Fleischmann
Wow. And what brought you, what made you make the decision? And did your whole family come with you when you moved here at 17?
Kam Ghaffarian
No, I came by myself with $2,000 in borrowed money, which I borrowed from my uncle, to come here and stay. I had this incredible love of the United States of America and also the space programs. So when I was a child, we were able to sleep outside in our yard, which a lot of people do in Iran. I used to look at the stars and be mesmerized by them. I would go to my childhood imagination about how far they may be. Is it possible that maybe there is life on other stars?
When I was 11 years old, I saw Neil Armstrong’s landing on the surface of the moon. Like many others, it was a transformational moment for me. I decided this is the journey I want to have and the life I want to have. With this incredible passion and love, I came to the United States.
By the way, this was way before the Revolution and all the other stuff that happened afterwards. So when I came, the relationship between the United States and Iran was very rosy and beautiful. It was a wonderful time to arrive.
Alan Fleischmann
When you came here — and you probably didn’t know, you were 17 years old — did you say, “Okay, I’m going to go for a few years and come back?” Or did you kind of know you were going to make this your permanent home?
Kam Ghaffarian
You know, I loved America and I wanted to be educated and stay here. I totally planned to go back, because my entire family was back there. But of course, things happened and I decided to stay. So in many ways, it was amazing synchronicity, because I love living in the United States, and I think America is the greatest country in the world and a place where dreams come true.
Alan Fleischmann
Well, you come from one of the most beautiful cultures in the world. I always say. When you come to my home, you’ll see both from the art and the poetry — there’s no country in the world that celebrates poetry and poets at a higher level and a more beautiful level than Persia.
Kam Ghaffarian
One of my favorite poets is Rumi, and I often read his poetry, either in Farsi or in English, and it’s just pretty incredible. I don’t know if you’ve ever listened to him.
Alan Fleischmann
I have Rumi somewhere here on my shelf. I have an older brother, who studied Farsi when he was very young and became fluent. So when he was in high school, he started to share Rumi with me when I was in middle school as a kid. It stuck with me.
Kam Ghaffarian
People don’t realize that he was such an incredible spiritual person. Not only was he an incredible poet, but he was an incredibly spiritual person.
Alan Fleischmann
I just was recently with a few very prominent CEOs, and I could not think about what to get them. They’re people who really, truly, could have anything and can afford anything. And I thought, “Gosh, what am I going to get them for their birthday?” It was two separate individuals celebrating a birthday together. I gave them both the Stoics, a beautiful hardcover of the sSoics from Roman and Greek times. And I gave them a book by Rumi— and actually a third book, Khalil Gibran’s The Prophet. Hardcover, beautiful editions. It was a gift for the next chapters of their lives. If we take the best of Rumi, the best of Khalil Gibran, and the best of the Stoics — and a lot of what we can talk about with you today, because you remind me of those great values and principles that are as relevant today, honestly, as ever.
I’m curious— before you became an American and made and really built the American dream, what were the big cultural differences that you had to navigate when you first came to this country? Because you were quite young at 17.
Kam Ghaffarian
Yeah. I mean, just imagine: 1977, I thought that I spoke English fluently when I arrived. The first place I landed was New York JFK Airport, and I felt like, “Why are people speaking so fast?” So I was telling people, “Slow down. Speak slowly so I can understand.”
But yeah, definitely, there was a little bit of culture shock. Believe it or not, it was the first time ever I got on a plane, from Tehran to arrive in the United States. So everything was new for me.
Alan Fleischmann
And if I’m not mistaken, did you go right to university when you got here?
Kam Ghaffarian
Yeah. I arrived in January, and then for the first few months, I went to this place called American Language Academy to get my English better, to be more fluent and be able to speak easier. And then the following semester, I started at Catholic University for my degree.
Alan Fleischmann
And that’s in Washington, DC. What made you choose Catholic University?
Kam Ghaffarian
It’s really interesting. The reason I arrived in Baltimore was because my uncle is a doctor at Johns Hopkins University. And usually people, when they come from other countries, go where their family members are. I didn’t have a whole lot of money. In fact, I could have gone to MIT if I wanted to, because I had very, very good grades. I was valedictorian in high school, and I was already enrolled in one of the top universities in Iran. But Washington, DC was close enough, and they had the degrees I was looking for. So initially I was thinking, “Well, I’ll go to that school, and then I’ll figure out going somewhere else.” But actually, I loved Catholic University, and that’s where I got my first degree from.
Alan Fleischmann
And your uncle was where you stayed in Baltimore. What was he doing?
Kam Ghaffarian
He is a doctor at Johns Hopkins University, a physician.
Alan Fleischmann
So you were close enough to family, but you were also far away. Washington and Baltimore; while they’re close in geography, often are very far away in other areas. So you went back and forth, but I bet a lot of people in Baltimore didn’t come to DC, and a lot of people in Washington didn’t go to Baltimore.
Kam Ghaffarian
Yeah. I remember taking a Greyhound from downtown DC to downtown Baltimore to go visit with him.
Alan Fleischmann
So tell us a little bit about your Catholic University experience. Had you known that you wanted to study what you wanted to study? Tell us a little bit about your focus areas.
I know you went off to get a master’s at George Washington University, so you kept in the DC area, which is exciting. Tell us a little bit about the thinking.
And I’d be curious — it sounds like family were great mentors to you in many ways, because they were so supportive. But were there mentors in high school? Were there mentors at Catholic University? Certainly there were mentors at George Washington University that came into your life.
Kam Ghaffarian
You know, Alan, my life is full of miracles. I call them miracles. And I’ve had such incredible people that God had brought to my life at different places. So it’s all of the above. I mean, incredible parents, my brother and sisters, uncles — my uncle who’s in Baltimore had a huge effect in my life.
But also, I came across some incredible people at Catholic University — the dean of the engineering school, people in the mathematics department, and so forth — that were incredible mentors.
And I have to tell you, I finished a double degree in three years while every night working in downtown DC, parking cars.
Alan Fleischmann
Where did you live? Did you live in dorms? Did you live in an apartment?
Kam Ghaffarian
No, I actually lived in Hyattsville, Maryland, which is right outside Washington, DC, not too far from Catholic University, because it was cheaper to stay there. I rented a room and I stayed there.
Alan Fleischmann
Amazing. Any mentors you’d want to focus on or share with us?
Kam Ghaffarian
There were a lot of people in my life who have inspired me in terms of the things they’ve done. I’ve continued to have incredible teachers that have inspired me and mentored me. I won’t mention any names, but there were incredible people in my life in high school and during my university years.
Of course, this is where I met my first wife. I was in engineering school, she was in nursing school, and the schools were right across from each other. So she was an incredible supporter of my journey in those early days.
Alan Fleischmann
Did you meet in class? I guess you weren’t in class together, but you met on campus?
Kam Ghaffarian
No actually, we met in American Language Academy, because she’s originally from Thailand. So we met in the language school, and then we continued to know each other, and then got married in 1980, after I graduated.
Alan Fleischmann
That’s right. And you graduated really young.
Kam Ghaffarian
Very young, yes. Finished the school in three years.
Alan Fleischmann
And did you go right from Catholic University to George Washington University?
Kam Ghaffarian
No, no. So remember, I was working every night and paying for my school. I would take 30, 33 credits a semester, because at that time, if you were full-time, it was the same price. I was trying to get as many credits as possible.
Then I started working immediately. At the same time, I continued to get my second bachelor’s degree while I was working. My first job was with a company called Compucare, which was supporting Georgetown Hospital in downtown DC in computers and medical stuff. I was supporting that program, then right immediately after that, I started pursuing my second degree part-time. All my other degrees I pursued and completed while I was working full-time.
Alan Fleischmann
Wow, amazing. And they were all full-time jobs, and you worked and studied.
Kam Ghaffarian
Yes. And building other businesses at the same time.
Alan Fleischmann
So what order were they? Because I know you’ve had Compucare in your career, as well as Lockheed Martin, Ford Aerospace, and Loral.
Kam Ghaffarian
Yeah. Loral. The order started with Compucare, then I worked for Perkin-Elmer, which was a big computer company in Rockville, Maryland. Then I saw this ad, they were looking for people at Goddard Space Flight Center, Lockheed Martin was. And I was like, “Wow, this is a dream come true.” So I interviewed and was able to get the job at Lockheed Martin. And then I moved to Ford Aerospace, which later on was sold to Loral. And I worked for Loral until I started my own company in December of 1994.
Alan Fleischmann
And that was Stinger Ghaffarian Technologies.
Kam Ghaffarian
Or SGT for short.
Alan Fleischmann
I guess, who’s the Stinger there? That was a very big, bold thing to do. Not everybody’s meant to be an entrepreneur. I always — I’m probably not right on the statistics, but I say 99% of the people should not be and 1% should. I just think it’s one of those things where you might be entrepreneurial and good to work with an entrepreneur, but it doesn’t mean you should be the entrepreneur. It takes a lot of courage to start your own thing.
Kam Ghaffarian
Thank you. Yes. So it’s really interesting. The guy that interviewed me on that first job after Perkin-Elmer was named Harold Stinger, who, at the time when I interviewed with him, was a pastor of a church in Vienna, Virginia. He also worked as an engineer full-time at Goddard Space Flight Center.
So he interviewed me and hired me, and we became incredible friends during the years at Lockheed. When I wanted to start my own company, I reached out to him and said, “Hey, do you want to do it together?” And he said, “Absolutely.” So he came over to my house, and I had this basement, and we actually had to move some boxes around so he could sit down. That’s where he and I decided to start SGT. That’s how the company started.
Alan Fleischmann
That’s amazing. And it just started with the two of you? Or did it start with —
Kam Ghaffarian
Yeah, just two of us. I had gotten a mortgage on my house for $250,000, and I was all in. If that money disappeared, I would be completely broke. That’s how we got started with that money, just literally two of us.
In the early days, we got this little office space in Lanham, Maryland. I was the janitor, the IT guy, the HR person — I mean, you name it, when you start a new company. I still remember when we got our first check for $17,000, which I still have. It was quite memorable when you make your first money as a startup.
Alan Fleischmann
I love that.
And were people all in favor in family? And did you have children at that point? I’m sure you had people that were encouraging you, and there were people probably who were discouraging you.
Kam Ghaffarian
Well, you know, like you said earlier, when you want to go on your own and you start something, there are a lot of naysayers. All the people said, “Here’s what’s going to happen, here’s the reason you’ll fail.”
This is an interesting story, Alan — I remember when I left Loral, in the old days, you used to go around and get these stamps that you’re exiting the company. I met this guy in accounting, and he sat me down for about two hours to try to tell me why I shouldn’t leave. “Here’s all the reasons. The economy is bad. Here’s the statistics of how many companies fail. And by the way, you’re doing so good in this company, you’ve moved up so fast, you should stay.”
At the end of the conversation, he said, “So you’re going to stay, right?” And I said, “No.” And he goes, “Didn’t you hear everything I said?” And I said, “Yes, I heard everything.” He said, “So why are you leaving?” And I remember telling him that I have this itch that needs to be scratched, and that’s the reason that I’m leaving.
But interesting enough, Alan, six months later, I hired that guy as my CFO. His name is Matt Yetman, and he’s been with me ever since, and he still is working.
Alan Fleischmann
That’s an amazing story, also, of longevity of trust and relationship.
Tell us a little bit about what SGT does or did, aa bit of that experience, some of the lessons you learned since you wore everything at the beginning, and how quickly you grew. Certainly, there are probably some lessons that you learned that you applied to your later ventures as well. Would love to hear that.
Kam Ghaffarian
So when I was working for Lockheed, we were a government contractor that provided engineering and technology services to NASA. So I decided, “Okay, that’s the business I want to start “— to become a government contractor, if you will. So that was the idea.
In the beginning it was really hard, but we got it going and we started growing. In a period of 10 years, we grew like 60x, right? We became the second-largest engineering services provider to NASA as a whole — all the NASA centers: Johnson Space Center, Goddard Space Flight Center, Glenn Research Center, Ames Research Center, all of them.
There were a couple of things that I would say were huge lessons learned. One of the books that really affected me very deeply that I read in the early years during the SGT journey was Good to Great by Jim Collins. How do you build great companies? It really deeply affected me. And I realized that, in order to really create long-term success, you need to build a foundation, a cultural foundation that is really important. At the center of it is your core values, what you believe in that are not lip service. Those are things that you have to live every day.
For SGT it was what we called ICE principles, which stood for integrity, customers, employees. Integrity at the center of everything that you do, bend over backward to take care of your customers, and take care of your people. And so those were the core principles. And we created this amazing culture where we had an incredibly low turnover rate as the company grew. And many of those lessons that I learned during those early years have been incredibly helpful in the other companies I formed later on.
Alan Fleischmann
And you founded X-energy, for example, while you had SGT? Not only did you study and work, you built companies simultaneously as well, which is pretty amazing.
Kam Ghaffarian
That’s right. So SGT started in December 1994 and I sold it in April of 2018 — 23 years, right? Remember, we started with like $250,000, and I sold it as a single owner for close to $400 million.
So in 2007 — now, remember, I’m a space cadet. Everything about me is about space and the space journey. Outer space is my love, my passion. But in 2007, there’s a guy that came to visit me and Harold from the Democratic Republic of Congo. He lived in Kinshasa, another pastor. And he asked us if we would be willing to sponsor four orphans in Kinshasa. I said, “Absolutely, yes.” So we started that, and then four grew to eight and 10 and 20 and 40 and 80. Later on we built a school. And today I have close to 1,400 kids in Kinshasa which we feed every single day. In fact, the mothers cook for them. And it’s one of the most beautiful things I’ve ever done that is so close to my heart.
But the school, Alan, did not have power. And so when you don’t have power, you don’t have education, you don’t have clean water. And it really inspired me that we need to do something different. And that was really the genesis of X-energy, which I founded in 2009. Today X-energy is a world leader in advanced nuclear. But that was really the inspiration behind X-energy.
Alan Fleischmann
And then were the offices co-located together?
Kam Ghaffarian
Yes. So my primary office was in Greenbelt, Maryland, which I’m sure you’re familiar with. X-energy was immediately, right on the same floor as I was as we started that company.
So that was the first company during SGT. Then 2013, I co-founded Intuitive Machines, which is the first private company ever, in the history of humankind, that has successfully landing on the surface of the moon. We brought the United States back to the moon for the first time since the Apollo days, after 53 years. Then 2016, I co-founded Axiom Space, which is building the first private commercial space station that replaces the International Space Station. Then in 2021, it was Quantum Space. And then 2022, it was PTX, which is another company.
So these are some of them. Many of them happened during SGT. A couple of them happened after SGT.
Alan Fleischmann
That’s very cool.
Then did you have employees at both companies?
With X-energy, tell us a little bit more about the full mission and how you really were filling a hole. But also tell us a little bit about the role of nuclear energy and how it’s been evolving over the years. How it has a major role in combating climate change and, actually, dealing with the energy limitations that we have. If we’re going to fully embrace AI and other forms of technology, nuclear energy sounds like it’s the answer.
Kam Ghaffarian
Absolutely. So when I started, and I was the first CEO and Executive Chairman of X-energy, I had this vision of clean, safe, secure, affordable. So I was looking for an energy solution that is 100% clean, 100% safe — in other words, you don’t have some electronics that create safety. It’s sort of inherently safe, right? No matter what happens — earthquake, tsunami, whatever — it doesn’t affect the safety. And secure, so it cannot be exploited by bad actors.
My vision was to be able to compete with natural gas. I had sent a couple of my engineers to MIT to explore what technology may be the right one. They met with the chairman of nuclear engineering at MIT, and they basically told him, “Hey, we have this crazy owner that is looking for this kind of solution.” At that time, he had a pebble, which is a tennis ball-size graphite, on his desk. He said, “This is the answer you’ve got to go show him.”
When they came and showed me the technology behind this, I was blown away that this technology actually exists. And I then hired Andy Kadak — that’s his name, the professor of nuclear engineering. I said, “Andy, where do I find people that have this expertise?” And he said, “South Africa.” I said, “What do you mean?” And he said, South Africa had started this company called PBMR — Pebble Bed Modular Reactors — and they spent a whole lot of money developing it. After apartheid, they shut it down. There’s all these engineers and scientists that are available there. So I actually went there and hired 15 people and helped get them migrated to the United States. That’s how X-energy was formed, with the idea of coming up with a transformational energy solution that solves the energy problem for the world. The design of it, Alan, is such that it doesn’t require water for cooling. The modules — and this was all by intention, by design — can be carried in the back of a truck or back of a train, so you can literally get it anywhere in the world.
It was a tough journey, because when I started that company, everybody thought that I was a crazy person putting money into this. This was 2009, remember, when I started this, way before all the AI thing happened. But I felt like there was this calling in me, to change the world for the better and combine altruism with capitalism to make the maximum impact. I put $100 million of my own money into the company to get it started and get it moving. It was a really difficult journey, trying to raise money. But last year, we won this amazing grant from the Department of Energy, which was close to two and a half billion dollars, 50/50 cost share, a few years back. And when Amazon was looking for power for their AI data centers, they researched all different technologies, and they chose us.
So we were able, just recently, earlier this year, to close a $700 million round. We’re building our first plant for Dow Chemical and additional plants with Energy Northwest for Amazon AWS. And so we’ve grown quite a bit, and the company is in a fast-growing pace. The total addressable market is humongous. I sort of shortened the story for you, but that’s it.
Alan Fleischmann
No, no, I love this story. It’s an amazing story, of what today is a multi-billion-dollar company. That’s a big gap, between where you started and a multi-billion-dollar company. But you saw something and you realized it. But it didn’t just happen. It happened with a lot of vision, a lot of sweat, a lot of perseverance.
Kam Ghaffarian
Yes, exactly right. With each of my companies, that has been a journey. I would say PDA — persistent, determined, and agile, right? In other words, you’re not locked into a certain thing, you’re able to pivot and figure out what the right answer is. And really that is sort of a common thread in all the companies.
Alan Fleischmann
And are there new companies coming along the way too? How many companies are active right now?
Kam Ghaffarian
About 10 of them that are active. That doesn’t include nonprofits and that doesn’t include investments. So I make quite a few investments in many other organizations.
Alan Fleischmann
So tell us a little bit more about your vision for space, your vision for energy, and how they connect.
Kam Ghaffarian
So, Alan, from childhood, I was blown away by looking at the stars. Then as I grew up, I started researching to see how vast is the universe. And the more I studied, the more blown away I was by how small we are in the context of the universe, right?
So just in our galaxy alone, if you leave our solar system and we are in our galaxy, which is called the Milky Way, the distance from one point to another is 100,000 light years. So you go with the speed of light, it takes 100,000 light years to go from one point of our galaxy to another. And in our galaxy alone, there are approximately 400 billion stars, 400 billion stars similar to our own sun, with planets around them. Just in our galaxy alone, okay?
If we leave our galaxy, we believe that there are maybe two trillion other galaxies in the universe. Two trillion. And some of them maybe a million times or more larger than our own galaxy. So when you think like that… I think it was Carl Sagan that said, if you want to sort of understand or comprehend how small we are compared to the universe, if you look at all the grains of sand on Earth, in all the oceans, all the beaches, all the deserts, everywhere, our solar system is like one grain of sand in the oceans of grains of sand. Our solar system. So you see how small we are.
So I have — this was something that I believe — the ultimate destiny for humanity is to become interstellar, where we go to other stars. That’s really my ultimate vision, to be able to travel to other stars outside our solar system. But in order to make any of that happen, you need to take steps toward that. So for Axiom Space, the vision for that is to build this space city outside of our planet, 250 miles above. Where people live and work and there is this own low-Earth orbit economy that is growing, and you can do manufacturing in this microgravity environment, and so forth. Then the next step is the moon, to be able to live and work and have a habitat on the surface of the moon.
So Axiom Space is for 250 miles above Earth. Intuitive Machines is for 250,000 miles above Earth, to be able to land on the moon and create a habitat. And Quantum Space is really about building these superhighways that you’re able to go from one planet to another, and later on, to Mars.
The nonprofit I’ve created, Limitless Space Institute, is really to inspire, educate, and do the research and development as to how you can go beyond our solar system to other stars. Really, it’s an educational institution where we want to inspire the eight-year-olds around the world as to how to come up with new engineering, new science, new mathematics to be able to do interstellar travel. So you see how all the dots get connected.
Alan Fleischmann
I love how it’s one ecosystem you’re building with a comprehensive vision, but you’re smartly not having it be executed by one. It could become confusing. To allow for excellence, you want to make sure everybody’s focusing on their lane.
Kam Ghaffarian
That’s exactly right. That’s exactly right. People say, “Why isn’t this one company?” It’s for what you just said exactly. I want them to be focused on one lane, rather than something larger than that.
Alan Fleischmann
And for you at the helm — and I’m sure you’ve got some colleagues around you — you know how to weave them all into one comprehensive vision and impact, which is pretty powerful.
So how many companies? It’s IBX, it’s Axiom Space, it’s Quantum Space, X-energy…
Kam Ghaffarian
Quantum Space, also PTX. There’s another company called Delivery Excellence, DX. There’s another company called IX, which is a joint venture between Intuitive Machines and X-energy. And a few others.
Alan Fleischmann
Then we have Limitless Space and we have Emerging Light Foundation.
You’re listening to Leadership Matters on SiriusXM and at leadershipmattersshow.com. I’m your host, Alan Fleischmann, and I’m here with an extraordinary visionary, successful entrepreneur, Dr. Kam Ghaffarian, founder and CEO of IBX and co-founder and Executive Chairman of X-energy, Intuitive Machines, Axiom Space, and Quantum Space. Frankly, the list goes on. We’re discussing his extraordinary career and enormous vision and impact.
Let’s talk about those nonprofit organizations for a minute, including Emerging Light Foundation and Limitless Space Institute. Why did you create them? Tell us a little bit about the initiatives.
I do have to say, I love the fact that you don’t dilute anything you do by mixing up missions and vision. You make sure that there’s clarity and purpose with each one of your enterprises, even though they do foster a humanity-focused vision for the future, using science and human touch in order to advance. There’s something really extraordinary when you take a step back and see the for-profit enterprises and the nonprofit organizations. You’re really building something that’s deep and far, it’s fascinating.
Kam Ghaffarian
You know, Alan, I wanted to share this with you, I think this is really important. Somewhere around the middle of the journey at SGT, I came to this profound understanding that if you want to have a successful life, it should be a life that is with purpose, with a mission. It’s not just about making more money, it’s about making more difference. So I made this pivot that I wanted to be involved in the companies, that each one of them impacted our civilization as a whole in a positive way and advanced the state of humanity and human knowledge.
So every single one of the companies, the things that we’re doing have never been done before. So it’s not only entrepreneurial, but it’s a first of a kind. I say we’re in the business of first-of-a-kind businesses, right? X-energy has never been done before in what we’re doing. Axiom Space has never been done before. Intuitive Machines has never been done before. Quantum Space, the same way, and the same way with Limitless Space Institute.
So my family office, where I manage all these companies, is called IBX. IBX stands for Imagine, Believe, Execute. So imagine a certain future, believe in it, which is the magic ingredient, I think, and then get off your butt and actually do it, get it done. So that’s the common thread.
Now to your question, I shared the story with you about how I started the school, and I developed this incredible heart for children, and especially disadvantaged children around the world. I said, “How can I impact them in a positive way?” Later on, I said, “Okay, if I’m going to do this a lot, what am I doing?” As you were showing me something about your father before we started, Lights and Shadows, I said, “I want to bring light to them.” That’s where the Emerging Light name came from, and that’s why I called my foundation Emerging Light. The idea is to bring light to different places in the world. Africa, India, other places, and the United States — all places that Emerging Light supports.
Alan Fleischmann
And it’s headquartered here, but it’s global.
Kam Ghaffarian
Yes, absolutely.
Then after I sold my company, SGT, in 2018, I was just thinking about what I shared with you, about this whole space and how vast it is, the universe, and how old it is, and all the things that I’ve done. And I felt like, “Man, we’re talking about something that is limitless.” Truly, the universe is limitless, and we are such a small part.
So that’s why I came up with this name, Limitless Space Institute. The idea is to inspire and educate kids. Today we have programs in Brazil and Nigeria, and we’re going to have things in South Korea, the United States, and many other places in the world to inspire and educate kids.
Alan Fleischmann
And are they totally different teams that are running or helping you run Emerging Light and Limitless Space?
Kam Ghaffarian
That’s correct. Two different organizations.
Alan Fleischmann
That’s very exciting.
Throughout your whole journey, your whole career, you’ve been an example, but you’ve also been a champion, even in the nonprofit world, when it comes to innovation. I’m curious how you foster a culture of innovation, and how do you teach innovation? Is it the people you hire that come with that in their DNA? I imagine it’s a little bit of that, but it also has to be a culture that you foster as well. I’m curious how you do that among your teams.
Kam Ghaffarian
I think you hit it. It’s all of the above, right? It’s not just one thing. I think one of the key things is hiring the right people. And that’s hugely important. I’ve been blessed in hiring some incredible people around me. In fact, I often say that God’s given me this ability to recognize talent when I see it, and also recognize my own deficiencies and how to create success by hiring people who are so much smarter than me. They make me look good.
So the people have been important, but also having this idea of disruption, right? Being able to innovate and being able to do things differently than it’s ever been done before and create realities based on that. I remember when I was researching Limitless Space Institute, I looked it up, and it said the definition, I think, is “infinite possibilities for those who believe.” So, believing in a certain future and having this persistent resilience and just keep at it till you make it.
At Intuitive Machines, we conceived, built, operated, and landed on the surface of the moon in four years with $118 million. That’s sort of unheard of, right? Normally speaking, it would take a lot more money, a lot more people, a longer time. But it was this concept of innovation, and I have these incredible people that work in that company with an unbelievable culture. The CEO, his name is Steve Altemus. He’s incredible. But that’s true with each of the companies. At X-energy, I hired a former Deputy Secretary of Energy, Clay Sell, who is the CEO, and he’s another incredible leader.
And it’s not like… Let me just share this with you, Alan. When you have a startup, none of them are straight lines. It’s like a roller coaster. I mean, you’ve got to go through fundraising, difficulty, and challenges. But I think the idea is you’ve got to stick with it, right, and finally get there.
Alan Fleischmann
I love that. Persistence matters probably more than anything. It goes into the IBX part — the “X” is where you don’t give up.
So you had several partners when you founded your companies as well. For others, you were the sole founder. Talk a little about those experiences. Did you enjoy being one of the partners, or has it been in many ways easier for you to execute by being the sole founder? And any other lessons there to share?
Kam Ghaffarian
You know, Alan, I often say that when you are in this space of inspiration and, I would say, spirituality, one of my favorite words is synchronicity. People come into your life sort of at the right time and the right place.
So like, Intuitive Machines. I met with Steve Altemus, and when we got together, I asked him, “Hey, Steve, what’s your passion?” And he was the former head of engineering at Johnson Space Center and former Deputy Center Director at Johnson Space Center. And he said, “My passion is to one day leave and use the space technology and aerospace, in energy, and healthcare.” So I said, “Why are you not doing that?” I said to him that it would be a shame for you to die with the music left in you.
That’s how we started Axiom Space, right? And we co-founded it with another amazing gentleman named Dr. Tim Crane. Similarly with Axiom Space, I was able to connect with a former program manager for the International Space Station, Michael Suffredini, who built the International Space Station. That’s how we started Axiom.
So amazing people have come across that have been able to take that journey and move it forward.
Alan Fleischmann
But I imagine, the more you became more successful, the more you were able to… It goes back to the guy who juggled a job and school and then juggled school and job. The more you were able to have your hands on the wheel, the more you could do multiple things as well. And it doesn’t sound like you’re slowing down anytime soon.
Space exploration, obviously, is at an exciting crossroads right now. What role do you see the private sector playing in shaping that future? And what do you think your own companies will do in actually shaping that future?
Kam Ghaffarian
I think commercial space has played an incredible role in accelerating space exploration. By disruptive technologies that reduce cost, right? So as an example, SpaceX, a commercial space company headed by Elon Musk, was able to reduce significantly the cost of transportation to space, which enables many other things to happen. Then there are other companies, like Blue Origin by Jeff Bezos — both of them are dear friends that have really been able to do things in space. They both have incredible passion for space exploration.
I think the same thing with Axiom Space, and Intuitive Machines, and Quantum Space. I think with the advent of AI, quantum computing, and robotics, they’re all sort of accelerating space exploration and our force multipliers, in conjunction with the government, to move forward.
Alan Fleischmann
That’s great. And then how much of a role — I’m sure the answer would be yes — and how positive is the additive value of artificial intelligence in all this?
Kam Ghaffarian
I think hugely. I think AI is a game changer, I really believe that in many ways.
The limiting factor for AI is power. That’s where X-energy comes in, to be able to power the AI data centers. But it’s also an accelerator in space exploration in many things. People take it for granted, but I use ChatGPT all the time when I want an answer to something or some analysis that needs to be done. Even in terms of “find me the best ways to organize” or “what are the different ways where you can raise money” — the amount of processing time that it takes for it to come up with incredible answers is remarkable.
I think it’s going to have a huge effect in space exploration, the same as robotics and quantum computing, if you will.
Alan Fleischmann
I imagine also, if we’re using space as a place for cures and advancement in science and limitless ideas, as you said, I imagine AI will help advance at a much more rapid pace.
Kam Ghaffarian
Let me talk about that for a second, because I think you’re absolutely right. This space station we’re building, the Axiom Space Station — people don’t realize this, but one of the most incredible laboratories in the world is microgravity, where there is no gravity, or very little gravity.
We’re able to print corneas and retinas in space that you cannot do on Earth, where gravity pulls the molecules down. So you can, in the future, print artificial hearts or lungs or livers in space. Because of microgravity, you can potentially come out with a cure for cancer in space or come up with anti-aging medicine. For example, we know that when you go to space, your aging gets accelerated very slightly. So if you know the cause for age acceleration, then maybe we can come up with a way to slow it down or reverse it. Or, for example, doing fiber optics in space that can carry infrared signals, which we cannot do on Earth.
So this whole microgravity is, I think, incredible — semiconductors, pharmaceuticals, orbital data centers. These are all things that you can do in a microgravity environment that you cannot do on Earth. And it’s a new economy, new ecosystem we’re developing.
Alan Fleischmann
That’s so exciting. And then in the next couple of minutes, if you were — you are actually right now doing this — sitting with a bunch of interested people who want to hear your wisdom… We started off our conversation offline talking about the irresistible combination of confidence, humility, and gratitude. Share a little bit about your principles that you live by. If you were to advise someone who is either trying to redirect their life or direct their young life, what would you suggest would be the principles you live by?
Kam Ghaffarian
You know, right before we started, we talked about something that I think is incredible, and it’s the concept of humility. I think there’s a proverb in the Bible that says pride and haughtiness goes before destruction. In other words, arrogance goes before destruction.
The opposite of that is humility, right? When I say humility, it’s saying that I’m willing to learn. I’m not the smartest person in the room, I’m willing to get better, respecting other people’s opinions, having the humility to listen, absorb, learn, and get better, to benchmark against other people. If you sort of have this idea that “I’m the smartest person in the world and I know everything,” then you’re not going to learn anything, and you’re not going to get better.
The other concept is the concept of integrity. If you open a business and you make a ton of money, but it’s harmful to people in some ways, what’s the point of that? So integrity matters. In all my companies, our core values start with integrity. I think it’s really important.
And then the other one is culture. When I say culture, I don’t just mean ethics and integrity, but a culture of winning, culture of innovation, culture of coming up with solutions, culture of extreme ownership, culture of accountability. Culture is like a foundation where you can build other things on top of it.
Alan Fleischmann
You’ve got an amazing energy, Kam. You’re an optimist. And I’m sure you’ve had many sleepless nights, especially since you launched so many things and so many things simultaneously. So it’s not like you had one full-time job where you had to worry; you had many full-time jobs over the years that you’ve worried about.
How do you balance the stress of worry and the strength of… In our culture at our firm, we say we’re a bunch of warriors and worriers. I think in many ways, that’s you. You probably are detail-oriented, and you’re concerned about making sure you’re successful, and the stresses must be enormous. But at the same time, you’re optimistic and you seem to advance.
Kam Ghaffarian
You know, Alan, many years ago, like 45 years ago, I discovered the power of meditation. So I meditate every single day. It’s sort of like getting off of the treadmill and reflecting, and connecting with your true self. Maybe even connecting to your higher self, or connecting to a higher power, if you will.
Believe it or not when I tell you this — I do sleep well, and I’m not as stressed as you might think I am. I’m challenged, but I try to have this posture of, “Okay, things are coming. They’re challenging.” You’ve got to figure out how to deal with it and be cool, calm, and collected as you deal with it. That doesn’t mean that I’m not stressed, doesn’t mean that I’m not worried, but I try to manage it. It’s the art of doing multiple things at the same time and compartmentalizing it, so that even when I’m sitting here focused with you, I have really all my energy here and being in the moment. So I think that’s helped me a whole lot.
Alan Fleischmann
And are there children in your life?
Kam Ghaffarian
Yes. I have an unbelievable son and four grandchildren, which is an incredible blessing.
Alan Fleischmann
Do they live far away, or are they nearby?
Kam Ghaffarian
No, they live nearby. They live very close to where I live in this area. My primary residence is in Florida, but I come here quite often and I travel quite a bit, because the space companies — two of them are in Houston. X-energy is here in Maryland. So I travel quite a bit between different locations.
Alan Fleischmann
That’s amazing.
Well, I knew we would need more than an hour based on the journey. But I think we’re getting a strong sense of your vision, your mission, your purpose, as you pointed out, and how you can go and truly take something, imagine it, build it, and then execute, which is very powerful.
You’ve been listening to Leadership Matters on SiriusXM and at leadershipmattersshow.com. I’m your host, Alan Fleischmann. We just spent the last hour with Kam Ghaffarian, founder and CEO of IBX, co-founder and Executive Chairman of X-energy, Intuitive Machines, Axiom Space, Quantum Space, and more. The man who has created nonprofit organizations like Emerging Light Foundation and Limitless Space Institute, and so much more.
It has been such a pleasure having you on the show. This has been a fascinating conversation, and I’m looking forward to more. Let this be the first of many times we can talk and bring you into the show, because the way you look at innovation, the way you see the future, exploration, the way you’ve built, you focus on talent and culture — we can learn so much more.
Kam Ghaffarian
Thank you so much. It was such an absolute pleasure and a joy having this conversation with you.
Alan Fleischmann
You too, big time. Thank you.